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Post  leachy 25/11/11, 03:29 pm

Anyone running weber 45s? and does n e 1 know what u need and whats involved i fitment ect

leachy

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Post  dominator 25/11/11, 04:08 pm

The carbs, and suitable inlet mani, throttle linkage, low pressure fuel reg, mk1 gti dizzy, aparently optional but personaly if your gona do it, do it right
What other mods will you be doing?
You cant just wack on the carbs and expect big gains, you will need atleast some decent cams and exhaust to take advantage of the extra air and fuel going in

Gary

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Post  leachy 25/11/11, 06:35 pm

ive got fast road cams and a full janspeed exhaust with 4 2 1 manifold, do u think that would b alrite. its things like the throttle linkage i would get stuck on sourceing i think. 2 b honest im not 100% on how they work Embarassed would i still have standard fuel rail fitted? i was thinking bout buying a head thats been port polished aswell could just do with a desent head really then i (with the help of a friend) could rebuild the bottom end. whats the crack with port polishing does it help at all if ur not turbo. and i dont suppose u would b interested in makeing me a manifold next year if i send u the carbs cuz i know u know what ur talking about and every other bit u av made me has been super high quality. my friend seems to think u can just chop down a standard inlet and pipe on the carbs but i wouldnt of thought so myself. cheers for the post m8 i can always relie on u to sort me out.

leachy

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Post  gtpswift 25/11/11, 09:39 pm

A good set of carburettors will cost nearly as much as a set of propper throttle bodies and will never be as good.
Webers and Dellortos which are the common side draft carburettors available are notoriously susceptible to age. old ones corrode, erode, warp etc so going new is in the long run the best practice, even going old youll probably want to rebuild them with gaskets etc. then like throttlebodies they will need tuning to suit the car, this is as costly as throttle bodies and can probably be done by ever decreasing number of tuners.
no point doing it if your going to dodge a manifold, a propper manifold will mount the carburettors at the right angle relative to the head. As with throttle bodies the inlet tract should be as uniform, step and obstruction free as possible matching the throats tot he manifold and manifold to the carburettors would be recommended but not essential to just get running.
An inlet port should not be polished, it should be many grades shy of polished to help mix the air and fuel, the exhaust should be super polished to minimise friction of gasses on the way out. It is more important on Normally aspirated engines than turbo to have this work done, of course if its done on a turbo all the better.
Carburettors use much lower fuel pressure than injection so this needs adjusting. throttle linkages are easily available new and or second hand and east to install.
so thats the fuel dealt wirth you will need spark. Rumour has it the Mk1 distributor has vacum advance so is the one to get as mentioned above, this allows spark timing to suit rev range, which the ecu would do in injection but needs to be analog in a carburettored situation.

Anyway thats enough for now.

GTP

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Post  Miniswift 25/11/11, 10:18 pm

Hi,

In order to run carbs you will need to do followings.
change fuel pump(carbs need 3-4psi)
Don't use Weber try get hold of Dellortos, they are better developed so it won't go out of tune 2 days later.
Or get R1 bike carbs, they fit and forget.
You will need to have mk1 Dizzy(if you can find 1 about £100), they are indeed mechanical with a vacume advance. If you run a mk2 dizzy, you will be running with get you home mode. I know it still works but not as it should.
Ask Gary nicely to make you an inlet manifold. You can cut up std manifold but you want keep it just in case you need to go back to std.

Ask around, there may be people with spares you will need.... like me!

Cheers
Atchi


Miniswift

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Post  leachy 25/11/11, 10:36 pm

well thats defo taught me alot i didnt know, thanx for sharing ur knowledge its much appreciated. i just love the way carbs sound and ive been told they add a ton of torque which is what im afta and ive just been looking on ebay and theres sum 1 selling r1 carbs on a gti manifold so i thought they would have been tryed and tested so i had a look at just a set of r1 carbs and u can buy a set for about 130 and with the help of sum 1 with the knowledge to make me a manifold i thought it mite be quite cheap aswell. is there n e other carbs that would b cheap and work well on the gti?

leachy

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Post  gtpswift 25/11/11, 10:42 pm

carbs make no more or less torque than anything else its to do with tuning secondly but physical parameters first. Longer Intake tract length creates torque
Carbs do sound good but throttle bodies do too.
GTP

gtpswift

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Post  Miniswift 25/11/11, 10:46 pm

Please make sure the angle of carbs mounted.
R1 is mounted 75 degrees(down drought). I have mounted mine on 52-ish degrees.
Some of Honda CBR1000 carbs are side drought so straight manifold will do.
I think you want 36 to 40mm size so 600cc to 1000cc will do. Most of bike carbs are easy to modify to fit 84mm part like G13B.

You could always ask Boggs brothers and scare yourself off with how much it will cost you in the end.
I think if you are lucky, it will cost you £600 before RR session.

Solid state fuel pump £80, dizzy £100, carbs £100, manifold £100, fuel pressure reg £60, air filter with plenum chamber £200.... Rolling Eyes .

Cheers
Atchi

Miniswift

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Post  leachy 25/11/11, 10:53 pm

Miniswift wrote:Hi,

In order to run carbs you will need to do followings.
change fuel pump(carbs need 3-4psi)
Don't use Weber try get hold of Dellortos, they are better developed so it won't go out of tune 2 days later.
Or get R1 bike carbs, they fit and forget.
You will need to have mk1 Dizzy(if you can find 1 about £100), they are indeed mechanical with a vacume advance. If you run a mk2 dizzy, you will be running with get you home mode. I know it still works but not as it should.
Ask Gary nicely to make you an inlet manifold. You can cut up std manifold but you want keep it just in case you need to go back to std.

Ask around, there may be people with spares you will need.... like me!

Cheers
Atchi
yeah i was gonna run the mark 1 dizzy but i was told they were really rare. do i need 2 change the fuel pump or would the low pressure fpr not do the trick. thinking r1 carbs is the way im going to go 2 be honest it seams alot cheaper. what bits do u have that u think i would be interested in? i do have a spare inlet but to be honest choping it dwn and fitting carbs myself is a bit out of my league if im honest.


leachy

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Post  Miniswift 26/11/11, 01:17 pm

Hi,

I have a spare mk1 dizzy.. yes they are rare but I have them.
I have an inlet manifold flange data which I can get it laser cut.

You will need a lower pressure fuel pump your injection pump will be too powerful to pressure regulator to control.
You can those bits as well as a plenum chamber from Demon Tweaks or ebay like I did.

I bought a Lotus air box off ebay.
I made back plate CAd and got it cut by laser in 3mm sheet Aluminium. It fit very good. I will be making adaptor plate for K+N filter for later but I'm building so many other things at the moment.

http://www.teamswift.net/gallery/image_page.php?album_id=471&image_id=7855http://www.teamswift.net/gallery/image_page.php?album_id=471&image_id=7854

I hope these link above works!

Cheers
Atchi

Miniswift

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Post  leachy 26/11/11, 03:43 pm

ive managed to raise the funds to buy the carbs and manifold thats on ebay so thats sorted im sure its the carbs dominator had for sale ages sgo but i missed the end of the auction. but im well interested in the mark 1 dizzy how much would u want for it posted to pl5 1qz i wont av the cash for a couple of weeks tho so would u be willing to keep hold of it for a while? do u really need the air box when my friend had webbers on his pug he just had like socks over the trumpet looking things, sorry im not too sure what the proper name for them is Embarassed

leachy

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Post  JDOG 26/11/11, 04:11 pm

I wanted to run carbs but its a pain in the ass

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Post  gtpswift 26/11/11, 04:53 pm

yes you can get away with socks, but as soon as you oil them they become restrictive. to do it properly you want a tuned airbox
carbs are easy almost easier than efi if you know what you are doing and can get jets and tubes etc to tune it, but just as costly
all carbs need jetting to suit your engine, the same dangers as efi of damage with incorrectly tuned carburettors.
Cheers
GTP

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Post  leachy 26/11/11, 06:43 pm

i was going to fit em with a m8 then take them to jre racing a place in saltash near where i live and get them set up i wouldnt have a clue how to set them up to b honest.

leachy

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Post  leachy 26/11/11, 08:52 pm

does n e 1 know where i can get the throttle linkage ive been told u av to make a custom 1 or u can buy a uni 1 and cut to fit.

leachy

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Post  Miniswift 26/11/11, 10:25 pm

Hi,

If you are running R1 carbs, you may need to drill it to 155(1.55mm) and set needle to the top mount.
This set up is for G13b with R1 carbs, air box, BD10 camshafts with std G13B setup. A guy I know in Oz did this mod and he told me about it. JP should know him as well Lee aka OZmidnight!!

Now, if you are going to fit R1, you don't need anything like that linkage stuff. You will just need to weld 5mm plate and re space it. It is very easy to do. If you want, I can mod R1 carbs for you.

mk1 Dizzy are expensive and I bought my last one for £100. I would like to have my money back so if you are willing to pay for R1 carbs mod and so on. You can have it for £100. Make sure to get hold of mounting rubber with clips. Or may be buy std R1 air box, it will come with rubber trumpets mounts(not trumpets) I bought mine for about £30 and my R1 carbs were £85. I think my Lotus Exige air box was £180. I can keep my dizzy that's no problem. If you have spare dizzy, you can get it modified too but it will cost you £180+VAT.

Good luck and contact me when you are ready to start!

Cheers
Atchi

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Post  leachy 26/11/11, 11:04 pm

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/120813992021?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649

these are what iv just bought. how much would u charge to do the mod on the carbs with that does that mean i can use the standard throttle cable.

leachy

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Post  dominator 27/11/11, 08:35 am

I cant belive they sold for that much again!
It was 450 when I did it now 330
I got the carbs for 25 so I dont even know if they work and by the looks of it he hasnt touched them, he had grand plans of makin a 170 engine with them blah blah blah
I put about 25hrs of welding and polishing into the mani, but I was very young so the runners are literaly mirror finish inside so you mite want to ruff them up a bit, theres 4 vacuum t points on the mani, all you need is to join them up so one end is for brakes the other for dizzy advance, the bloke thought it was for fuel suply
The engine leans forward 15deg, I took this into account so the bowls will be perfectly flat
The inlet ports on your head WILL need matching to the mani as I remember them being alot bigger on the mani
Thats about all I can tel you atm

dominator

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Post  Miniswift 27/11/11, 09:35 am

Wow.... I wasn't expecting that much.
You could made it a lot cheaper but hey, since Gary's old one it should be alright as it is.
All you need now it to find bits I told you about.
I don't know if std cable will work or not as I have a custom setup for mine.
You need to check how much space you have after fitting it to see what shape an air box you can have.

In this below link you will see in 3rd photo that rubbers where carbs go in. You will need to buy them.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Yamaha-R1-4XV-5JJ-AIRBOX-1998-2003-/260898006982?pt=UK_Motorcycle_Parts&hash=item3cbebba7c6#ht_500wt_1360

Let me know when you are ready.

cheers
Atchi

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Post  leachy 27/11/11, 11:32 am

BOLLOCKS so u rekon ive just been ripped off Embarassed how would i tell if the carbs are working the lad lived 5 mins away from me so i picked em up last nite. i always do this just run in2 things guns blazing without thinking it through. yeah the lad did say he hasnt fitted them so they have been just sat in a box for god knows how long.

leachy

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Post  JDOG 27/11/11, 12:39 pm

I cant see why they wont work if they dont it will be something easy to replace surely

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Post  dominator 27/11/11, 10:45 pm

I wouldnt say ripped off, im just lookin at it from my perspective, they cost me 25 for the carbs, a tenner for the vacuum ports and a few hrs work
I was happy to get 200 for it so I was well surprised with 450
If your worried about the carbs take them to what ever tuners you will be using and get them to giv it the once over

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Post  Miniswift 27/11/11, 10:59 pm

To me and Gary, it is a lot of money.
I can make half of what Gary can make so to me that was a lot of money.
My cylinder head and 4x custom inlet manifolds were made with port and polish mod for £200.
This was done over 2 years by my engine builder who worked on whenever he wasn't busy. But I have to wait for him to get on with it for 2 years...

Go to bike shop and get hold of universal brake cable kit. You should get a small wire grip which you can fit in carb throttle linkage bit. You should be able to get them for £10.

Good luck.

Cheers
Atchi

Miniswift

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Post  leachy 01/12/11, 09:03 pm

got a few questions but bare with me as im quite clueless and i could just be asking stupid things but the mixing of air and fuel goes on in the manifold rite so what do u do with the holes where the injecters go? also the mod i think it was miniswift was on about doing to the carbs a 5mm spacer plate what is that actually for? and also what are these rubber mounting things from the r1 air box i need for? and my friend said on his webbers u had like a rubber gasket to stop the carbs rocking is this that? like i said these mite just seam like stupid questions i need need 2 know as much as i can about it b4 i tackle it with my m8, hes a mechanic and knows his shit but he defo hasnt put carbs on a swift b4 and i just dont want it to look like ive bought em for him to fit with no real help from me 3 of charge Very Happy

leachy

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Post  hobo 01/12/11, 10:03 pm

ii know fuck aswell but you don't use injectors with carbs and i think gary said the holes are for the ignition timing because you will need to use a vacuum dizzy
hobo
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